Where does online metadata fetching get stored?

Hi there,

I have two SMB shares one for TV and other called MOVIE, Infuse is connected fine and is fetching the online metadata fine.
I am trying to figure out where this data is being stored, is it within the app itself? Is it stored in iCloud?

I have xml for all my movies and tv shows, but this is in the XBMC format which Infuse doesn’t like to read.

Essentially I don’t want to lose this data since it’s taking a really long time to fetch it all, I would love a way to store this on the SMB share itself or a way to export this or backup the database file.

Can we have an option in an update to select what type of xml file we want to use from the system menu?

EG:

Settings

MetaData

Select MetaData format

  • Infuse (Default)
  • XBMC
  • WDTV

Cheers!

The actual metadata is stored on the device (Apple TV, iPhone, etc…) though changes made via the Edit option will sync between devices using iCloud.

If metadata fetching seems slow, you may check to see if the Embedded Metadata option is enabled. Disabling this will speed up fetching, and will still allow you to use external XML/NFO files.

1 Like

Excuse me for bumping an old thread. I have an ipad that is low on storage space. I’m using Infuse over NFS, so my movies are only available at home anyway, shared via WIFI. But fully indexed, the metadata stands at 1.4GB. I had to delete it. I would like that metadata would be available only on iCloud, else I really have to restrict what movies I choose to make available. Is this possible? It would seem not, from your reply above. Please advise.

iCloud Sync is enabled in the app and under Apple ID / iCloud in my iOS settings.

It’s not possible at this time, but one thing you can try is installing the current version of Infuse to see if that helps.

For a bit of background, in Infuse 5.6.1 we reworked and optimized how Infuse stores data, so any content added after updating to 5.6.1 would use this new logic.

Thank you for the reply.

I’m using 5.6.1. I’m doing all this only in the last few days, on new devices.

The first time I added folders via NFS, I had iCloud disabled. If I delete all of that, and start over with iCloud enabled, will Infuse now store the metadata on iCloud as opposed to this device?

It would be great if this became a more obvious option in future versions.

Having iCloud enabled won’t affect how much space Infuse uses on your device, but it will allow you to keep shares, favorites, and other settings in sync between devices - or if you need to reinstall the app.

More info on what iCloud Sync can be used for can be found here.

Thanks. So for the time being, I have to restrict what I can include in my library.

It would be great if in a future release Infuse can provide the option to keep metadata off-device, on iCloud, or maybe even on target storage, for those mainly streaming.

In my specific example, there’s no real need for that data to be on the device itself.

I am increasingly seeing infuse fetching all my various metadata pretty much every time I go into Apple TV of late…it is a huge nuisance and if I revisit app after a few minutes it seems to have need to re-fetch stuff it only just fetched minutes prior (if I watch activity thru Library in Settings. )…I have deleted a bunch of apps on Apple TV and will see if any difference BUT there has not been any real change pn the device to warrant sudden extreme lack of space that this suggests.

More importantly though…it is the fact it is also losing all my manual corrections that is more bothersome…so for now, I have a couple questions specific to that aspect:

  1. Is there some basic metadata for a given file stored on the device even if there is further corrected metadata syncd to iCloud…and if so, if Apple TV clears my regular metadata as part of it’s own (selfish) space management, safe to assume infuse will NOT know to fetch a coore ted version and me/others have to fix it again as direct result ??

  2. If there is an iCloud syncing issue specific to infuse (let’s say not enough capacity for iCloud account)…where/how could we investigate and make determination that corrected metadata is maybe not being stored in iCloud ? (is corrected metadata also kept on device while space allows ?? …which could give impression of having retained/syncd on iCloud when it actually has NOT ?)

Thanks Moo

In consideration of comments made about “losing” manual corrections, I got to wondering if the correction still actually resided on iCloud but INFUSE had somehow lost addressibility to be aware of it. I don’t know how it is designed to know to go look but if there is a library index that relies on indicators for a given file, maybe it is no longer set !?

I toss this up as possibility based on an observation where I just deleted the metadata off my iPad (ios) to see of I could eliminate some recent concerns…metadata indicated 3g’s of data…when library refetched all the metadata, thumbs, etc…the new metadata total on device was only 644mb !!! (another 30-40 manual corrections was not going to influence that number by much)…aside from whether INFUSE is or isn’t doing any housekeeping there (maybe even by design for performance efficiency ?), it seems to suggest that it created new records for large chunks of my library along the way and maybe lost whatever link existed to the corrected metadata for it (just speculating)…with the space for metadata seemingly not very optimized or sync’d, it seems like that could be HUGE issue on APPLE TV in particular where much less space is typically available to begin with and where Apple reports the ACTUAL space used by apps and system so inaccurately (or not at all)…it is not inconceivable that INFUSE compounds the need for Apple TV to clear space on device arbitrarily by allowing excessive metadata to linger (at the time my iPad had 3g of metadata my Apple TV showed 1g of metadata…and MAYBE not all were even necessarily the current records for the library which is why infuse was still fetching misc and still missing earlier corrected metadata ?!)

re Apple TV space management…the only info device provides in Manage Storage is the space app took upon installation (best I can tell) it doesn’t report space for secondary data space since accumulated…for eg as I type, INFUSE app indicates 58.4mb even though infuse reports 1gb metadata exists) Nowhere does it report how much space tvos system features eats up nor device space remaining. Anyone (like myself) that allows for DAILY downloads for Aerial screensavers probably exhausts most available space with no means of knowing how much or no ability to clear directly…likely increasing risk of Apple TV wiping infuse metadata during it’s routine sweeps for free space. (seems entirely lame on Apple’s part but that’s outside scope here)

As I look to try and minimize risk on Apple TV…could you confirm whether any need for infuse to refetch metadata caused due to Apple’s clearing of that data for it’s own housekeeping measures, means that corrected metadata on iCloud gets orphaned as a result and this is the frustrating cycle of having to re-fix stuff repeatedly ?

Very didficult for users to manage…even if I were to change aerial screensaver downloads to NEVER, no idea whether Apple would would ultimately release space for apps and situation would improve or if it might still be inclined to wipe third party APP space first.

I stumbled upon developers site for TVOS that stated the various space limitations imposed upon apps…that alone seemed inadequate to hold additional space required for infuse metadata for a mid size library…yes ?! What alternative do we have for stability and protection of corrected metatadat…is this LOCAL METADATA option imply that data would be stored in the source directories for our library and even though maybe slower to load scrolling etc, the info would at least be protected from deletion ?

I COULD LIVE WITH APPLE TV REFETCHING METADATA IF I DIDNT HAVE TO PERUSE LIBRARY FOR REDOING MANUAL CORRECTIONS…MAYBE THERE’S WAY TO CHECK ICLOUD FOR AN ENTRY FIRST BEFORE GOING TO MOVIE/TV DATABASES TO DO LOOKUP AND GET WRONG ONE ??

Anxious to hear thoughts on what you think is going on or extent to which Apple TV making it difficult for you to handle it. (Combined with huge disparity re the 3gb becoming 644mb on ios metadata too I’m just starting to speculate way too much babbling while troubleshooting…will cease until I understand better…thanks)

In cases where tvOS clears out metadata (Infuse will never do this on its own), your manual corrections will be pulled down from iCloud automatically.

Additionally, with the upcoming 6.0 release, we’re working to sync all metadata to iCloud, so Infuse will be able to download a full copy of your library, in cases where tvOS decides it’s running low on space. This should be noticeably quicker than the current implementation where Infuse will need to rescan all your files if the cache is lost.

One other thing to keep in mind is manual corrections will not apply to some share types, most notably UPnP and DLNA. The reason for this is Infuse never has direct access to the files, and is simply reading an indexed file list provided by the UPnP/DLNA server. This list can often times change when videos are added or removed, so while the same files may be present, they will appear in a new location and Infuse will treat them as new. The same thing can happen if you rearrange items on your server, as Infuse relies on the full directory/file path for syncing manual corrections.

I can’t voice it strong enough, the option to back up all of the metadata to the local NAS is far more appealing to some of us who have plenty of local storage and accessible at much greater speeds compared to minimum iCloud storage and very slow internet speeds.

Please consider this at least as an option.

Thanks…much to digest.
I believe there was indeed a situation where I recently ported 200-300 gb folder from Windows directly onto NAS, so in hindsight that likely explains some of the lost/orphaned corrections.

It sounds like you are otherwise saying the manual corrections will be OK even if Apple had to refetch all the metadata…I’m less certain now about my experience re the big move of files I just mentioned but didn’t this very thread (or some other) already mention a number of people who were repeatedly losing their corrected metadata hand in hand with infuse having to fetch all the metadata on their ATV4s and ATV4Ks ?? (I can’t see those posts while replying…)

Re 6.0 release…hmmm, interesting. A couple things come to mind.

  1. Does that likely mean many of us will now need to $ and expand Apple iCloud subscriptions for greater space allowance ??
  2. If you only pull those details as required, does that mean it is almost certainly going to have an impact on scrolling speeds thru library content…with even greater detrimental impact to those with slower internet connections ?? …or are you planning to load/cache in entirety when app is launched…and then fetch from iCloud again on the fly only if Apple cleared something during extended session ??

Yes, that’s correct. Assuming the files haven’t moved, and you are not using UPnP or DLNA, then manual corrections will be saved to iCloud and available to download should the Apple TV lose its cache.

With regard to 6.0, we’re working to make this flexible as possible and will have options for what type of things can be stored in Cloud. For example, someone with a large library who is on the free iCloud tier probably doesn’t want to sync all their artwork to iCloud, but still wants to have things like watched history synced across all their devices. We’ve still yet to flush out how granular these options will be, but rest assured we’re not trying to force anyone into paying more money for iCloud - unless of course they want to. :wink:

In most cases, downloading info from iCloud will only take place once per device, then little bits and pieces will be updated as needed (like if you watch something, or make a manual correction on a second device). The main goal with this is Infuse will have one central library, so you’re not having to scan files on every device you have (which can take some time). This should not have any impact on Infuse’s UX when browsing through screens, or searching for content.

I’m sure you have pretty good grasp of the current issues for most so look forward to whatever is decided.
And as you indicate, even for APPLE TV…even Apple wipes cached metadata at least you can repopulate from the cloud rahter than look it all up one by one again !!

I’m less fussed about possible cloud costs (although it would be shame re iCloud when I already have 1TB free with Onedrive)…I ultimately would support whatever is better for performance and the user experience (speaking for myself anyway)

Thanks for sneak peek…enjoy rest of day.
Will monitor experience short-term to see if any other strange occurrences.

I used to suffer the same problem a few weeks ago with only Plex and Infuse installed. I ended resetting the Apple TV and the issue went away.

Oh ya ?! Thanks for your details…was that a full reset where you had to redo ALL your personal settings on device and download apps again…or just sign into Apple account and pretty much good to go ?? Were you doing Aerial screensaver downloads too ?? It sounds like doing that likely cleared more space on drive that either the other various apps or probsbly Apple, did not clear up…tempted to do same, although almost certain to be only temporary peace until such time Apple TV decides to steal some space back (if I limit aerial screensaver downloads after doing a reset, maybe hang time is gonna be good though !)…James, what is probable ETA down the road for moving all the metadata to iCloud/other ?

Sorry for the delay. I suppose after a week you have tried resetting the apple tv. If not, here are some details

I think something went wrong with tvOS after trying so many betas this year. The day before the reset, every app was constantly deleting the internal info, not only Infuse (!).

OK…one more before we head into the holidays. SO…tonight I get message that Apple TV ran low on drive space and cleared metadata and artwork. AGAIN…it finishes refetching the 1,400+ entries and I immediately see by the counts that it has again lost (or not used) the CORRECTED metatdata on iCloud for my 23-24 applicable titles. (interestingly, the ios version was open on my lap in iPad at the time and by the time Apple TV finished refetching, the ios app also reflected the revised counts and no longer had the corrected metadata even though I had not lifted a finger) SEEMS to me…that something weird still going on with how it works together. You said recently that it would go check on iCloud FIRST before either using (or fetching ?) the incorrect metadata for that file. Are you suggesting that every time app opened that if there is no metadata AT ALL that infuse will still go check iCloud first for an earlier correction…or is there is an index on for infuse that is needed but was similarly wiped away by Apple ? It definitely does not seem to be working in these instances. OBVIOUSLY…you will not be spending any period of time investigating it if you expect to change how all the metadata is to be referenced, but I mention it since it was apparent that Apple had literally just wiped it and the combined refetch was unable to recover any corrected metadata from iCloud !! Too bad too because it has been 100% good since my last reports…counts stable, manual scan attempts found nothing to fetch, etc…SOLID ! (NEW aerial screensavers seem to be pouring out from their end at a rapid pace of late so that likely triggered the space issue…as before, I care less about that and more about the lost corrections)

This is really bugging me haha (dog with bone)

Is it at all possible that infuse (wrongly) assumes that if it finds no metadata PRESENT for a given file (like when Apple TV clears it) that it does NOT even check iCloud for any possible correction and instead just goes and fetches from movie database again. Maybe there’s an assumption that a metadata record would at least exist for the entry (the incorrect metadata)…sure seems like it responds differently if the metadata record is gone. (jmho). Also too when you consider that I said the ios app reset counts for movies/tv/other and lost access to the corrections there too, that did not happen until the TVOS version was actively rebuilding, which almost sounds like it was INFUSE that cleared those corrected iCloud entries ! …again maybe by mistaking the situation when no metadata was present.

Highly speculative I know, just trying to help…don’t know what the logic flow is like for it, only interpreting my own results from the parts I do know. I don’t think I’m even going to attempt to fix them anymore until new method is implemented…or fix is identified.

Thanks for listening…happy holidays everybody !